It's a penalty not a tax, because only freeloaders pay the Healthcare penalty

[kentay]

The only ones in our country that will be penalized is the freeloaders who can afford health care but choose to use hospital emergency as their healthcare provider,  just over 1 percent of the population will pay the penalty. It would be interesting if you knew what Political Party the freeloaders  belong too. I personally do not want to pay for someone who can afford healthcare but choose to let others pay their bills. If this were a tax everyone would have to pay it.

Think about the following being a tax or a penalty?  A traffic violation, Early withdrawal from an IRA or 401, Airplane Tickets not use, Utility bills not paid on time, When you don't pay your Federal or Local taxes on time. ThiMk kenaty
   
Penalty = Something, especially a sum of money, required as a forfeit for an offense.

Tax= A compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits

[RWE]

The only ones in our country that will be penalized is the freeloaders who can afford health care but choose to use hospital emergency as their healthcare provider, ... It would be interesting if you knew what Political Party the freeloaders  belong too.

I became an adult in 1973. Since that time I have been to the doctor twice. Once to receive five stitches when I cut my hand. The  other time to have skin cancer removed (actually several trips to the same doctor). Each time I paid cash out of my own pocket. If there are any freeloaders out there, they are the ones who don't work yet receive health care from those who do. I wonder to which political Party most of them belong.

Tax= A compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits

Let's see...The "penalty" is collected by the IRS and the money goes to the US Treasury. I don't see much distinction between this "penalty" and a tax.

[kentay]

What if you get something serious that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars are you prepared to pay that kind of money out or would you become just another freeloader? I have owned a home and for years I have paid big money for insurance but have never had to use it. I am glad I didn't have to use it and I help pay for someone else who did use it. All insurance is that way and you're gambling and hoping nothing like that happens to you. But if you have already had Cancer at a young age then I would say that the genes needed to fight it are either corrupt or weak in your body. I became an adult -1954 and have never had cancer or any major illness but I have always been happy to pay for my insurance so others like you who need it wouldn't go into bankruptcy. But because of your unwillingness to buy healthcare you may become a freeloader if you should live long enough. You need to reconsider your youthful thinking and become a more responsible adult. kentay 

[RWE]

I don't own a home but I have money in the bank to buy one. In the past (before Obamacare), someone like myself could buy high deductible health insurance that would only cover catastrophic events like you describe. I could break my arm and go to a doctor, pay cash without involving an insurance company. Now ObamaCare requires that I have full a coverage plan that costs much more than what I would need to protect myself from being a financial burden to you or anyone else. And in case you weren't aware, going to the emergency room isn't free if you have any assets. They send you a bill.

---freeloader [?fri??l??d?]
n
Slang a person who habitually depends on the charity of others for food, shelter, etc.
freeloading  n---

so, do you consider any one who collects welfare or food stamps to be a freeloader?

[kentay]

No I don't RWE, only people with money enough to take care of themselves but use government handouts by manipulating their taxes or wealth. Remember Jesus healed the sick and helped the poor, for free. I could never vote for today's Republican/Tea Party/ Libertarian/Christian Party of Hypocrites and call myself a Christian, could you? kentay.

[RWE]

Remember Jesus healed the sick and helped the poor, for free. I could never vote for today's Republican/Tea Party/ Libertarian/Christian Party of Hypocrites and call myself a Christian, could you? kentay.

As I recall, Jesus is omnipotent. How can Jesus call Himself a Christian when He can heal the sick and feed the poor but chooses not to? He expects me to take care of them? Isn't that a little hypocritical of Him?

[kentay]

RWE, he maybe why don't you ask him? kentay

[Ted S]

The only ones in our country that will be penalized is the freeloaders who can afford health care but choose to use hospital emergency as their healthcare provider...

I don't believe that's true.  Everyone, regardless of income or wealth must purchase insurance as I understand the Obamacare.  Even fantastically wealthy and healthy folks will be required to purchase a government approved policy when it may make more sense for them to buy coverage for catastrophic events and pay for routine visits out-of-pocket.  Obamacare it seems to me is designed to benefit the lower class at the expense of the upper and middle classes.

It would be interesting if you knew what Political Party the freeloaders  belong too.

In general, freeloaders belong to, and support, and vote for the most progressive political parties.

I personally do not want to pay for someone who can afford healthcare but choose to let others pay their bills.

I'm with you on this point.

If this were a tax everyone would have to pay it.

This might be news to you but not everyone pays their fair share of taxes.  For instance, 47% of wage earners pay no income tax. Their weight is carried by the remaining 53%, and especially by the top 10%.  How fair is that?

Penalty = Something, especially a sum of money, required as a forfeit for an offense.

Yep, that's the definition of a penalty.  However, is my not buying insurance harming you in any way?  You're not harmed until you are forced to pay for my healthcare.  If I don't force you to care for me, you have suffered no harm and if you have suffered no harm why should you be penalizing me?

Tax= A compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits

Taxing authority goes WAY beyond this limited definition.

Oh and welcome kentay!  Glad to have another voice here.

[kentay]

Thanks Ted for the welcome. I just think  citizen like myself who have made it have an obligation to help those for whatever reason didn't. When I grew up I had the Greatest generation as my role model and I saw the results of a country who worked together and built the greatest  middle class the world has ever seen. I also know that all of them saved the world by volunteering to fight for all of us. That so many men had went to fight women were needed to work in the factories and offices. I remember when CEO made 20 times their highest worker instead of 80-125 time today. I remember when everyone carried about their neighbors. Back then everyone volunteered for Military services compared today when less than 1% fight our wars and the rest of us start them and then go shopping. If the greatest generation had felt the way this generation feels and what they cares about; we wouldn't have built the largest  middle class and we might be speaking German or Japanese instead of English. The only ones that are better off today than they were in the 40-50's is the Blacks who finally got their freedom after hundreds of years in bondage. I am a Christian man who attends no church or organized religion and dogma. Religion like most all of  society have become selfish, greedy and bloated with self grandeur. They  have broken from the teachings of Christ as he taught his message while he walked on earth. BTW: it was Reagan who fixed it so some citizen pay no Income tax but everyone pays SS and Medicare taxes. I could go on and on because our country has changed and not for the better and our awakening is going be hard unless we come to our collective senses soon. kenaty.      

[Ted S]

I could go on and on because our country has changed and not for the better and our awakening is going be hard unless we come to our collective senses soon.

I agree with the general point you are making here but when you look at the big picture, not the fine details, but the big picture, the question is; has the country gotten more conservative or more liberal in the recent past?  I say the USA is more liberal in more ways than it was during the glory days of our childhoods. And if it is more liberal than it was 50 years ago, and it's in worse shape than it was 50 years ago, a rational person should be able to conclude that even more liberal progression will lead to an even worse quality of life.

The USA is not more liberal in every single way but economically speaking I don't think there is any question that the massive programs of the welfare state, that so please the left, have done nothing but grow bigger and more numerous.

In my opinion, if you want to return to the glory days of the past generation, you have to return the size and reach of the government to that generation as well.

[kentay]

I could go on and on because our country has changed and not for the better and our awakening is going be hard unless we come to our collective senses soon.

I agree with the general point you are making here but when you look at the big picture, not the fine details, but the big picture, the question is; has the country gotten more conservative or more liberal in the recent past?  I say the USA is more liberal in more ways than it was during the glory days of our childhoods. And if it is more liberal than it was 50 years ago, and it's in worse shape than it was 50 years ago, a rational person should be able to conclude that even more liberal progression will lead to an even worse quality of life.

The USA is not more liberal in every single way but economically speaking I don't think there is any question that the massive programs of the welfare state, that so please the left, have done nothing but grow bigger and more numerous.

In my opinion, if you want to return to the glory days of the past generation, you have to return the size and reach of the government to that generation as well.

[RWE]

Ted, I don't know what country you been living in because even the Republicans brag we are a center right country. The last time we were a liberal country was from FDR through Johnson when the last of the great society improvement... From then on its been going right and the farther right...

I don't know what planet you've been living on because Johnson's Great Society is still in place. Maybe if we repealed the welfare State he created and had 45 years to see what the country was like afterwards, then we could make a fair comparison. The revolving-door jails aren't full of gang bangers raised without fathers because of right wing policies.

[kentay]

Ted, I don't know what country you been living in because even the Republicans brag we are a center right country. The last time we were a liberal country was from FDR through Johnson when the last of the great society improvement... From then on its been going right and the farther right...

I don't know what planet you've been living on because Johnson's Great Society is still in place. Maybe if we repealed the welfare State he created and had 45 years to see what the country was like afterwards, then we could make a fair comparison. The revolving-door jails aren't full of gang bangers raised without fathers because of right wing policies.

RWE, the jails are full of people of color because of unfairness of drugs charges is different for whites and people of color. The pro life people love the fetus but the hell with the born child. We need more early intervention and head-start for all children especially the poor children. We are a center right country that is failing ever since the 1980 until present. Clinton turn over 5.6 trillion as far as the eye could see along with 4 years of paying down the deficits. Then the right took power started two unpaid for wars, started a prescription  pill program and all of them place on the future Generations charge card  and still managed to spend the 5.6 trillion. No president since The Great depression had a worse turn over by another party than what the Right turn over to the Left. That is fact not  RW spin.   kentay    

[RWE]

We are a center right country that is failing ever since the 1980 until present. Clinton turn over 5.6 trillion as far as the eye could see along with 4 years of paying down the deficits. Then the right took power started two unpaid for wars, started a prescription  pill program and all of them place on the future Generations charge card  and still managed to spend the 5.6 trillion.   kentay

You are confused. During Reagan's two terms the house was controlled by Democrats and the Senate for two years. Government entitlements expanded every year. Bush I had both houses controlled by democrats. government entitlements expanded every year. Clinton had two years with a democrat controlled house and senate. It wasn't until the house and senate went republican that any deficit reduction occurred. You complain about the right taking over...then brag up Clinton for the things the right did. You are confused. Then, yeah, Bush was too liberal with spending and ran up "the future generations charge card." But since obama took over he has ran it up even worse and you praise him. You are confused. 

[clistensprechen]

Here's a reminder that in Reagan's day, there were more Blue Dog Democrats plus Reagan Democrats than there were liberals under today's definition, part of which Newt Gingrich defined, but after Reagan's era.

Here's a reminder that the ruling of the Supreme Court is final. It's a tax.